Mentorship and Virtual Networking with The Neurotransmitters team

Meet the Neurotransmitters! In this episode, we go behind the scenes with The Neurotransmitters team: Drs. Tirtha Sawant, Rida Farhan, and Ricardo Vivanco. They reflect on their personal journeys as international medical graduates (IMGs) seeking mentorship and pursuing residency in the US. 

• Struggling to find mentors?  
• Not sure about the dynamics between a mentor-mentee relationship? 
• Learning to navigate the virtual world of networking?
• Trying to overcome shyness? Find it hard to reach out to people? 

Tune in to listen to some heartfelt stories and actionable tips that will hopefully inspire and empower you in your own journey!

You can find Dr. Ricardo Vivanco on Twitter/X at @DrVivancortex, Dr. Rida Farhan at @ridafarhan and Dr. Tirtha Sawant at @tirthasawant10

• Check out our website at www.theneurotransmitters.com to sign up for emails, classes, and quizzes!
• Would you like to be a guest or suggest a topic? Email us at contact@theneurotransmitters.com
• Follow our podcast channel for The Neurotransmitters @neuro_podcast for future news!
• Find me on Twitter @DrKentris (https://twitter.com/DrKentris)

The views expressed do not necessarily represent those of any associated organizations. The information in this podcast is for educational and informational purposes only and does not represent specific medical/health advice. Please consult with an appropriate health care professional for any medical/health advice.

Transcript

Dr. Michael Kentris: 0:01

Hello and welcome back to The Neurotransmitters, your source for all clinical neurology-related learning. So I'm your host, Dr Michael Kentris. I'm very pleased today to have some multiple very special guests with me. So, as some of you who follow us on X may be aware, the Neurotransmitters social media account's been picking up over the last year and particular last few months, and I'm joined today by my team members Drs. Tirtha Sawant, Rida Farhan and Ricardo.

Dr. Ricardo Vivanco: 0:35

Oh, my God.

Dr. Michael Kentris: 0:35

Ricardo Vivanco.

Dr. Ricardo Vivanco: 0:38

Yeah, yeah, yeah, you got it.

Dr. Michael Kentris: 0:42

So, oh so embarrassing. The problem is your Twitter handle is not your last name, so it always throws me off whenever I have to find you online. I'm so happy we might cut that later in post.

Dr. Michael Kentris: 0:53

I'll leave it up to Rida's discretion, but uh these are the people who have been helping me to build the neurotransmitters over the last year and and I am so grateful to all of them. So when they came to me with this idea of reflecting on what has it meant to be an international medical graduate applying to the US, match, the values of mentorship in various capacities, I thought it was a great idea and hopefully will help a lot of our listeners out there. So thank you all for coming on in front of the microphone today and kind of sharing your experiences.

Dr. Tirtha Sawant: 1:29

Thank you for having us.

Dr. Michael Kentris: 1:30

Perfect, happy to be here, so let's just have you all go around. Ricardo, will you start us off? Give us a little bit of your background, tell us how you wound up here with us.

Dr. Ricardo Vivanco: 1:40

Sure, yeah. So I am a medical graduate from Ecuador. I actually graduated in 2022. So I first met Dr Kentris through this Google form, through X, formerly Twitter. I didn't get used to the X name, but I signed up for being, you know, graphic designer assistant for the podcast. You know, medical education and infographics is something that I have always been interested in, and especially if it's something related to neuro. So it was nothing.

Dr. Ricardo Vivanco: 2:22

It was not a difficult decision, I would say, even though at that time, I was writing my personal statement and I decided to focus on the success. But then I met this incredible team of people that has been very supportive through the match but also has taught me several things, not only on neuro, but also about how to handle these team meetings and, you know, organize what we should publish on Twitter or the website, and you know, it's been great, great teamwork. But then I think that we are here today for because we should talk about mentorship and I I want to start talking about, maybe, my experience regarding the match, but also through medical school. So I think I consider myself a very shy person, so maybe that's why it was hard for me to approach someone on X initially, and I think maybe through all my medical school I didn't have a mentor, let's say, but a fixed mentor. I had several professors who would help me whenever I needed to, but no one that would guide me to where I need, what I wanted to be. So I remember that I took my step one during medical school, which was a hard decision, because I did that all by watching YouTube videos about, you know, the match process and how to study for step one and what else.

Dr. Ricardo Vivanco: 4:12

And I remember that at first I, you know, I didn't even consider doing my residency in the United States. I just wanted to see how I was doing compared to medical students from abroad. You know, us has always been a big, a leading country in science and you know, medicine is not an exception. So I started starting for my step one, for that started, um, uh, starting for my step one, uh, for that. And then I knew if I just didn't have the score, uh, that I wanted, or I felt that I just could go to another path, so, uh, but hopefully I I passed it. And then I remember that after that, I reached to one of my first mentors at that time.

Dr. Ricardo Vivanco: 5:09

After that, I reached to one of my first mentors at that time, who became a great friend, who I haven't met in person yet, but it's an Ecuadorian who you know is doing. It is right now it's a neurologist, a board certified neurologist there in the United States, and I remember talking with him and talking a little bit anxious about my process and how I was worried about getting these medical rotations in the United States and if it was worth it because of the cost and the time, or should I do other things? And this was after my step one. So there were some options, but not a lot of options as we know, as IMGs there are. So the thing I remember the most about that conversation with him was the relief I felt about him telling me that I was doing pretty good actually, because he took the step one after graduating from medical school. And you know, and and it's, you know, it's it's a very different thing to watching through, you know, youtube videos and knowing in inside myself that I'm going through the right path. But someone else telling me, someone else that has gone through that path, it's a very different thing and I think I appreciated that kind of relief at that time. So I think that was my first turning point and a kind of cheer up for my journey through this match process. So then I was, I kept in contact with him and I actually met a lot of more people through him. You know, he kind of put me in contact with some other Ecuadorians there in the States either doing research fellows on neurology or doing residency in neurology there. And then I met, I think, my other mentor. That has, you know, has become one of the conversations with him, has become one of the turning points of my match process with him has become one of the turning points of my match process.

Dr. Ricardo Vivanco: 7:25

I remember that after doing a couple of rotations I wasn't sure if I was ready for applying to the match and I was considering on doing a research fellowship first, which will take me another year and maybe postpone my application for another year. And actually he told me that in his opinion I should apply as early as possible. I had graduated, maybe it was one year after my graduation. So that was a conversation, maybe a little more of a year ago, maybe a little more, but then that's the reason, maybe he's the reason I am playing this year and I'm very grateful for that because you know, if not maybe I wouldn't get. Things would have to get more complicated, maybe I wouldn't get this research fellowship position and maybe I will have spent much more money that I have spent till now.

Dr. Ricardo Vivanco: 8:24

So, having his counsel, his advice, was pretty, pretty, uh valuable at the time and you know, um, I think I owe them a lot, um, to these two mentors.

Dr. Ricardo Vivanco: 8:37

And then during my match process, uh, I've met also other wonderful people who has helped me, either with interviews or, you know, writing my personal statement, um, or sponsor me on twitter, like dr countries himself. So, uh, I'm pretty careful for that and I think the bottom line of all of what I'm saying is that, um, you should not be shy in terms of applying for, you know, seeking help and applying to the match. What I've learned is that most of the IMGs and some of the, you know, american residents no residents, but neurologists or physicians like Dr Kentris are willing to help for several reasons. For several reasons, but mostly IMGs because they have a feeling of giving back what they received when they were applying. So that could be my first advice seeking help whenever possible. And then the second one is accepting every help as possible, because there are different type of mentors and every help and every advice, every point of view from them is always valuable and you could take whatever you like or not. Take whatever you dislike, so it's always your opinion, so yeah.

Dr. Michael Kentris: 10:05

All great points, thank you.

Dr. Ricardo Vivanco: 10:09

I don't know, and maybe Rida or Tirtha has different opinions about their journeys on the match.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 10:19

So maybe you could share. Yeah, sure, so I'm Rida and I'm a medical graduate from Pakistan. I graduated in 2021. And so I mean, I'm just going to give a little background from where I'm coming from, which basically is why I needed somebody as a mentor.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 10:50

First generation doctor like I am one of the first people in my um, immediate and extended families to become a doctor. Um, and, believe me, I have not tried to explain the match process to them. Uh, um, and that is because, uh, earlier, when I was leaving for my US rotations, I tried, I sat down and explained to them for hours and why and what I was working towards. And then, one month later, when I was in the US, and so one of my relatives of the extended family members, who is a medical student and is frequently in touch with me, she messaged me and she was like your family was here and they have no idea what you're doing. And I was like, yeah, okay, nevermind about that. So, so, so, and I mean there is no doctor, and then also, I don't have any relatives in the US as such, and and especially like, within my community, it is not exactly conventional to be pursuing training or even higher education abroad. And so I faced quite some backlash, especially as a girl. I mean, they are now coming around to sort of accepting it, but I did not really have like a strong support system there. And then all of my friends who are applying to the match all of them are coming with like families of doctors and they have relatives in the US and nobody was applying to neurology. So it just became like a very isolating journey for me.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 12:24

Um so uh, and last March, if I compare, uh a year ago, I was like uh, just having a, I was following the last match, um, and people were posting on X, uh, how they have all these mentors and how they're grateful for all of them, and I was like so envious of all of these people and I was like where are they finding mentors? And uh, and I mean I would like kill to have somebody like a trusted adult to turn to for career advice. Like that was a luxury, uh, that I did not have. And, and I was hoping so, by that time I had managed to get like a few rotations after months and months of cold emailing. So I was hoping when I go for my rotations I'll be able to form this connection with my mentors, like my preceptors and hopefully that will you know sustain me through the match cycle. So I went with that expectation to the US.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 13:26

So one thing that I would say, one advice that I would give, is find the right people people you want to, people who are in the same field as you, people who are on the same track that you want to pursue. Because there are, I know, as IMGs and I hate using the term desperate, but we are sort of desperate for rotations and people will take up anything they'll find. So I've, like my mentors, my neurology mentors have told me stories about people who apply I mean who came to them for rotations saying that they wanted to apply to neurology and then never apply to neurology, ended up applying to internal medicine, and I mean that was their plan all along. They were just not honest about it. So do not be that person. If you are seeking, like a different rotation, then at least be honest with your mentors, because if they are taking a chance on you, they deserve to know what you are really applying for. And that also ruins chances for the other IMGs as well, because one of my mentors actually said that you know she had stopped taking observers. For this reason, I had to be persistent and prove my research skills and eventually make my way through that. But point being, don't do that. You're just ruining things for yourself and for other people. So that's one thing.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 14:56

So, anyway, I went to the US in the hopes of, you know, making these great connections. And then you know, with everybody on X and Reddit, and people were like, if you know, you're at your A game, in the rotations you will end up with this excellent letter of recommendation and all of my rotations were like a month long. So three rotations for three months. And so so I I came in with this expectation and I tried to, you know, be at my A game, as I could be, and but but in the, at the end of the month, I did not have that, that great connection that I was hoping to hit Like it was. It did not hit the sweet spot that I was hoping. It was a great and it was a good relation, but it wasn't great. So like it went from zero to good, it did not go from zero to great and I ended up being quite disappointed.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 15:50

So when I was, like returning to Pakistan, I was actually pretty disheartened that I had done my best and I still hadn't managed to get that, you know, great connection that I was hoping for, and even in the next. So I started, um, some projects with these mentors as well. So I was in touch with them even after I came to Pakistan and I was working with them and by, I think I came back like at the end of August, and by November I was still feeling pretty um, gloomy about it. That, uh, I had, you know I had, I was exhausted, trying to prove myself to every new person and it's not going anywhere and I'm not feeling it. But then I think you know the compounding effect happens over time and in December some things happened that sort of made me realize that all of those connections had now gone from good to great over time.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 16:50

And that is like one thing in hindsight that I would say is do not give it time. Like any other relationship, a mentor-mentor relationship is going to take time. You're not going to go from zero to great immediately. It will take a few months to build that trust and rapport. And hang in there. Uh, if you, if you feel exhausted, uh, hang in there and eventually it will, it will work out. So, and coming to specifically to Dr. Kentris. Uh, if you will let me, Of course.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 17:29

So I was in July. He posted the volunteer announcement and the call for volunteers in mid-August. Around that time and around like one month earlier in mid-July, I was rotating at Vanderbilt in the epilepsy monitoring unit and I was scrolling and, unlike Ricardo, I was not aware of Dr Kentris's superstar status.

Dr. Michael Kentris: 18:03

That's an exaggeration at best. I was not aware at all.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 18:06

I was following him, but I was not aware at all. I was following him, but I was not really familiar with anything about him. In my defense, he doesn't have epileptologists in his bio.

Dr. Michael Kentris: 18:21

So that explains I used to, but I had to cut back on the characters.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 18:24

Okay, Continuum Having continuum in your bio should be enough. No, for me it's the, for me, it's the epilepsy buzzword. So so I was scrolling X, as usual, and I came across this audiogram that you had posted with your interview from Dr Nupur Goel, and. And for those who don't know what audiogram that you had posted with your interview from Dr Nupur Goel, and for those who don't know what audiograms are, they are the snippets of audio that we post on our X or whatever social media you follow us on, and if you don't, then please follow.

Dr. Ricardo Vivanco: 19:04

They're the backbone of the Neurotransmitters account.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 19:08

Yeah, yeah, they're the backbone of the neurotransmitters account.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 19:10

Yeah, yeah so. So I came across this audiogram, which I did not know was an audiogram at that time, but, um, it was a snippet from, uh, the interview with dr napoor goel and she was talking about how her mentor, Dr Buletko, had given her the advice on how to um, change, to transform her challenges into opportunities, something along those lines. I don't remember exactly, but that is sort of something that I resonate with a lot personally and try to do. And so that you know, I got intrigued and I went to the Neurotransmitters and that was the first podcast I listened to and in that podcast Dr Kentris mentions that he did his epilepsy fellowship at Vanderbilt and I may or may not have dropped the phone at that point, just kidding, I didn't but I did follow the channel and I was very intrigued and I did stalk probably you or the neurotransmitters at that point, and this is one month before you had that call out from volunteers. So I I made a, I mean it. It seemed interesting. So I made a mental note that I'm going to check this out once. Uh, I was in the middle of my rotations and traveling and all of that at that time, so I was like, once I'm done with this, uh, I'm going to, you know, listen to a few more podcasts and see what your deal is, and once I, once I have some sense of what you're trying to do or create, uh, I will send you a well-informed email suggesting ways on how I can be useful to you. So that was something on my to-do list even before you posted your call for volunteers.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 21:03

And then also, that's one thing that happened at Vanderbilt. And the other thing that happened was I was talking to this other um mentor and she and I was like we were talking about, uh, neuro humanities and we're talking about, like, the love for creative writing, and and I was telling her, you know, I'm trying to figure out ways on how to merge my non-medical interests with medicine, specifically neuro, so graphic designing and animation and writing. And she was like, whatever you do, just start, like, get involved somehow and start publishing or doing something about it, because once you do, then more opportunities will open up. And I wasn't sure because I mean, I'm not, I'm not, I don't have any experience being a neurologist, I'm not even a trainee yet, and I preferably wanted to do something in neuros.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 21:55

I wasn't sure how solo I can do something, you know. So I was also kind of reflecting over her advice and thinking of ways I could do something. And then I came across your channel and I was like, okay, this is something I could give a shot. But before I could give a shot you posted the call for volunteers and I was like oh, my God.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 22:23

And then I opened yeah, I opened the Google Doc and I was like, oh my God, that was the second. Oh my God. And I mean that was exactly. I was like, oh, you're looking for me, you just don't know it yet. I'm kidding, I did not think that, I'm just saying this, but I did think that I am the perfect person for it and I mean, the rest is history. So I applied, but I have learned a lot from him and he could be the one mentor that I can say not forced the one mentor who has had a significant influence on my journey and my growth, um, especially over the last few months, and I I mean I do. I will take up extra things to do in the neurotransmitters as an excuse to stay connected to him, because I enjoy picking up his brain.

Dr. Michael Kentris: 23:26

I'm very fortunate to have had your help over the last year, Rida Thank you.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 23:32

Thank you to you. So yeah, so I am very grateful to you and hopefully we will continue beyond the match.

Dr. Michael Kentris: 23:46

Fingers crossed.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 23:48

What do you mean? Fingers crossed?

Dr. Michael Kentris: 23:50

it's a.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 23:50

It's a good luck thing no, no, no, no, as in you, you should be sure that we are going to continue beyond the match well, yes, I mean, I'm, I'm confident of that part.

Dr. Michael Kentris: 24:03

I want, I want you all to have for those. You know, we're recording this on march 1st, so we are, you know, just a couple of weeks pre-match at this point in time. So by the time this comes out, we may, maybe we'll have an addendum to record onto the end there with some good news for everybody. But we are not yet through the match. So I'm hoping for good things for everyone on the call.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 24:31

Okay, perfect, thank you. Through the match. So I'm hoping for good things for everyone on the call. Okay, perfect, thank you. Um, so, yeah, so just last two sort of key um.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 24:49

If you, if you like, ask somebody on how to take make the most out of your rotations or make the most out of your um mentorships, people will tell you to be on your a game, right, so show up on time, be, et cetera. And that is sort of considered the upper limit to being like be the best you can. It's like the upper limit. But in my humble opinion, I think that should be the bare minimum to do, because if somebody is taking a chance on you, then honoring that commitment with 100% should at least be the bare minimum. And if you want to go above and beyond, then reciprocate. I'm sure all of the attendings have too many things on their to-do list and they wouldn't mind if somebody takes some things off their hands. Do that. Be that person. Be the Jonathan that every attending needs. Um, be. Be the jonathan that every attending needs. Yeah, so, so that, um, and and make yourself useful. So I mean, obviously nobody's going to hand over things to you. So, like, if, if your mentor is like research focused and learn some research skills if they are like. One of my um mentor is research, so I'm working with her on researches, with Dr Kentris I'm working on whatever social media and podcast editing stuff, and with another of my mentors. She is like she has a private practice, so she has an Instagram page and a website and you know for, obviously, promotion stuff and I ended up writing blogs for her and you know for obviously, promotion stuff and I ended up writing blogs for her and you know, making infographics and stuff. So I mean, that wasn't a requirement on my part as a rotation, but that was like a way of giving back to the mentor and making things easier for them or doing something that would you know lead to their success. Like it is a relation, like any other relation, it's a give and take relationship. So if they're invested in your success, you invest in their success. It should go both ways. That is something I staunchly believe in.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 26:57

One and two virtual networking. I have read a lot. I had some friends ask me if you know being on Twitter landed me interviews. I had some friends ask me if you know being on Twitter landed me interviews. I've read posts on Reddit saying, oh, we're so glad we never made these Twitter accounts and get involved in all the drama that is happening. And again, I know we've had a lot of drama this cycle.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 27:22

But how you use your social media is up to you. If you want to be involved in the drama, then fine. But if you want to use it constructively, you can. Like that shouldn't be a pride factor that you don't have an account or you never went on x, uh. There are many ways to use it constructively and with so many people who are coming in the med ed space and especially, like, as IMGs, you don't need, like, visa, you don't need financial barriers, like all of these barriers are not there when it comes to virtual networking. So there is literally no reason for you to not be on social media and connect with people. And even if it doesn't land you interviews, you will still have a lot of update on what the current you know things are happening and let's in your Twitter and that actually helped me a lot in my interviews.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 28:17

You know, just maintaining conversations with interviewers. I mean, I don't know we'll see what happens on 15 March but hopefully that we are very introverted and we don't know how to network or we don't know how to connect. That is fine. I am a staunch introvert like you. Don't have to just be all flashy or just go out and I mean this is virtual networking just make and literally you don't even have to post anything Just follow the right people and your target audience.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 29:16

If I use my social media director terms, your target audience shouldn't be fellow match applicants.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 29:23

I mean sure you can connect with them, but your target audience should be people you aspire to be.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 29:27

I mean sure you can connect with them, but your target audience should be people you aspire to be.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 29:30

So, whoever is on the track that you want to pursue and you will find many people and follow them and see what they're posting there will be people in the meta space who are posting regularly and all of us know that posting on social media consistently is not exactly a piece of cake.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 29:49

And if you can learn some skills there are so many people who are running podcast channels or YouTube channels and if you can learn some skills like video editing and podcast editing or graphic designing, animation stuff like that infographics you will actually be very useful to a lot of people out there and you can, you know, just observe these people, how they're posting, what they're posting, and, after you know, a couple of months of observation and learning some skills, reach out to them with a thoughtful message that this is how you can be useful, like I hopefully would have reached out to Dr Kentris if he hadn't already posted. So do that and I think like if you start quite a few months before the match, you, by the time you are applying, you will have like a great connection and, and you know, one connection will lead to a few others and it's just just keeps compounding then from there. So yeah, those are some of my key takeaways and my journey attendings.

Dr. Michael Kentris: 31:16

I didn't, and it made life a lot harder for me trying to, because I also was like a first generation physician and so I didn't have anyone in the family to really ask advice from, didn't really have any strong mentors in medical school. So I kind of I did it exactly the wrong way in terms of using all of these resources, these soft skills, if you will. So I definitely recommend everything you suggested as being a better path than my own. Thank you. Last but not least, Tirtha, tell us a little bit about your background there.

Dr. Tirtha Sawant: 31:47

Sure, hey, everyone listening in today and thank you, ricardo and Rida, for your wonderful journeys. Even I didn't know that much about you guys, so it was great listening to everything. So, yeah, my name is Tirtha Sawant. I also graduated in 2022 from a Caribbean medical school and I met Dr Kentris last year around this time. To be very honest, I do not even remember how and why I reached out to him. I think it was probably just fate. I DM'd him on X or Twitter and it was mainly for just life advice. I was really at my lowest and he was just there supporting me and telling me to go on. I believe it's very similar to you know things that he had experienced as a medical student and I connected with him a lot on those aspects. And, moving on from there, we just I just talked to him for advice and you know strength, and then from there, I found out that he narrates for Continuum and I asked him hey, you know, this sounds really interesting. And I was super scared because, being an IMG, of course we do come with, you know, our respective unique accents. And I remember asking him will I be able to do this? One? I'm not really techno savvy and two, like I'm going to have to practice how to pronounce every word you know in the American accent. And he said you know what, don't worry about that, we have a great team and we'll you know, we are very welcoming. So just give it a shot and try to see. And how it goes.

Dr. Tirtha Sawant: 33:26

I remember recording my first article for Continuum and around three-fourths down the line I had to scrap it due to some technical errors and I was so, so scared. I remember texting him on my phone. I'm like, hey, I don't think I can do this. The deadline is in like three days. I'm going to have to scrap this audio. And he was like, listen, let me help you out, go to this, do these controls, let me help you out. You know, go to this, do these controls, click on that. He had me figure it out and I re-recorded the entire article again and it was when I did submit it and, ms Schroeder, I've continued. She got back to me. She said I don't have any edits for you. You know, it's perfect, it's good to go. And that was just amazing. I feel like if, if not for his support and his push, I probably would have given up with that one audio that seemed to destroy my life at that point.

Dr. Tirtha Sawant: 34:22

And then, you know, moving on, he he did mention about neurotransmitters Vaguely. It wasn't really a published website at the time and it was, you know, like his abstract ideas. We all know dr Kentris. He can talk for hours and hours describing what he's working on. Um, so, yeah, I remember uh just telling him once, hey, if you ever need help, just let me know. And he said, yeah, I'll hold you on to that.

Dr. Tirtha Sawant: 34:50

And then I guess it was was in June or July when he did reach out and I was like I would love to help you, like I may not know what needs to be done to you know, launch the website and get volunteers and everything, but I just want to be a part of giving back to you. For me it's like I love working with people. I think gratitude in this industry, in medicine and healthcare, is extremely important and I just wanted to be a part of his journey, of, you know, his journey to success and stardom, as you called it. So yeah, it was. It was fun working with him Initially. You know sort of brainstorming ideas how to get more volunteers and, uh, every aspect of neurotransmitters, podcasts and quizzes. And you know how the social media is going to work around. Um, yeah, and it was wonderful. I got to learn a lot from him. I got to learn a lot from you guys. I think I, I it's. It's very important in the mentor mentee relationship, where you it's a two way street right you get to learn a lot and also your mentor does. I guess I hope they also get to learn a lot from us. So I got to learn how to make infographics and how to edit audios and how to make posts and you know all of that. And had it not been for him and his platform, I wouldn't have ever learned these skills. So it's a huge thank you to Dr Kentris.

Dr. Tirtha Sawant: 36:19

And moving on to generally in the world of mentorship and social networking, yes, as IMGs and I think having that advantage of being Gen Zs, we have taken advantage of, you know, the social networking world and having everything at the tip of our fingers with you know, virtual networking and even though last year I didn't have a lot of followers and I was like a nobody, just watching people posts and, you know, just figuring out how are they doing this, how are they? You know, don't, don't they have any social anxiety, um, but I sort of overcame that and I saw the the the bigger picture of social media and how, like you mentioned, how you can use it constructively, and due to that, I reached out to a lot of uh people, but not in a way that to bother them I don't think I went down the route of cold emailing. I put in a lot of research in terms of which physician attending is doing something that I feel value in, because I really wanted to reach out to them and see if I can contribute to you know their platform, whether it was my volunteer organization, whether it was my research mentor, uh, each one of them is someone that I would say I I had picked, and I feel like that sort of came in my email when I did reach out to them that I really want to work with you. Uh, this is something that resonates with me and that's one advice I would give to applicants this year or in the following years that you know they do say a lot that you have to email a bunch of people. It may work for some, it may not work for some, but if you really do know your specialty and your niche and where you could contribute best. I would highly suggest to reach out to those people and see if they're willing to help you.

Dr. Tirtha Sawant: 38:14

And there are a lot of people out there who, you know, do this without any other benefits or expectations, like Dr Kentris himself. And yeah, if you reach out to the right people and if you have something to give to them, you can definitely, you know, find it worthwhile working for them as well. And there was another thing like even in terms of the match, I'm sure NMatch, the platform that sort of paired us with, you know, our mentors. I hope he's also listening in to this podcast because I would love to give him a shout out. I won't mention his name here, but he's been very instrumental as well. Would love to give him a shout out. I won't mention his name here, but he's been very instrumental as well in terms of just advice, career advice about programs, about my application and everything related to the match.

Dr. Tirtha Sawant: 39:03

So we just being very grateful to have these mentors in every field and sort of learning from them. And this person being, you know, a PGY1 resident, it really shows that a mentor doesn't really always have to be an attending as well, it could just be a friend, it could just be someone who's already matched and willing to help you, and there are so many out there who are willing to help you in these aspects. And yeah, moving on from there, I feel like you guys have covered a lot of topics and I'm like getting blank now. Yeah, just final advice for you know, this relationship of mentors and mentees is be consistent. As mentees, we have to be the one to sort of plan things right. We, you know, it's obvious we need the help more and they are the ones you know just being grateful and sort of giving us the right direction.

Dr. Tirtha Sawant: 40:03

So it's important for us, as mentees, to be consistent, respond to their emails and really structure your schedule according to you know their lifestyle, because these are attendings or residents or physicians who may be extremely busy, and every second that they sort of devote to your journey is extremely important and it's important to show that gratitude as well. So, you know, present day it's been over a year I've been working for neurotransmitters and I love the people that I work with. Being the director of personnel, I think it suits my personality. Like I said, I love working with people, I love learning from people. I do think all of us have our strengths that we contribute to as a team, and Dr Kentris being the guru, the king of the jungle, he's definitely sort of brought out the best from each one of us. So, yeah, just very happy to be here and making this for him.

Dr. Michael Kentris: 41:05

No, it's been great having all of you involved with this. As you all know, I do tear at this point. I can ramble on about ideas forever and then, uh, my execution needs a little bit of, uh, just encouragement from time to time, which I appreciate, uh, despite my sometimes cranky demeanor. So so, thank you all for keeping me on the straight and narrow and making sure you know that that is one of the great things that first Tirtha, and then Ricardo and Rida after, had made sure that when I was doing this on my own, I would maybe record an episode once a month, maybe once or twice if I was really feeling motivated, once or twice if I was really feeling motivated. But since having you all involved with it, you've helped me stay very diligent, very regular, maintaining a regular pace, and that is one of the things.

Dr. Michael Kentris: 42:03

If you have to, that mentor-mentee relationship, you have someone to hold you accountable as well. It's not just me spitting things off into the internet with no feedback from anybody. I hear criticisms, which is good. I don't end up in the echo chamber of my own head, so it is important. There are benefits, even though, as you said, you're not quote-unquote neurologists, you are people who are interested, who are engaged, who want to create useful things, and that, I think, is just as important, and I do appreciate all of you. So any final thoughts anyone wanted to share or any questions I need to answer?

Dr. Rida Farhan: 42:51

I have a quote in mind Go ahead, I don't know. I read it probably from one of the people you follow? It went like you know it doesn't the journey or the destination doesn't matter, it's the people you end up connecting with. That matters along the way, and I think with our team, because the journey is probably going to be longer and we're not sure of the destination, but it is our daily quirkiness or connections that sort of keep us going and encouraging us to, just you know, keep working on this consistently.

Dr. Tirtha Sawant: 43:32

Yeah, us to. Just you know, keep working on this consistently.

Dr. Michael Kentris: 43:36

Yeah, yes, that is one of the the most interesting things you know to, to both what tirtha and what you're saying. Rida is, uh, that I've met so many interesting people through, through networking online. Uh, even even in my own career and I've heard some people refer to it, as you know, increasing the surface area of your luck where you, you know you're, you're putting yourself out there, you're taking chances on things and you know, not everything's going to land a hundred percent, but some of those will, will someone, and maybe that person reaches out and you build a new relationship and that can be pretty awesome. So I think that's a great thing. That I've learned over the last couple of years is just the importance of just taking a shot at something. I consider myself a very strong introvert as well, believe it or not.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 44:34

We believe it. I was painfully shy.

Dr. Michael Kentris: 44:38

I was painfully shy in high school and that's part of what my problem in medical school made me. I had to break that habit or else I would never be worth a darn as a physician, as a physician, but it was still one of those things that took a lot of work in terms of like I need to do, at least at times, break my natural tendencies and, you know, make those connections, and it has been very fruitful both, you know, from a emotional friendships as well as from a professional standpoint. So I think I think those are all important points to keep in mind as we engage in this kind of the new public square online.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 45:20

On the topic of being shy, not in med school, but earlier during my high school, my teachers complained. The only complaint that they ever had was that we have never heard her talk.

Dr. Tirtha Sawant: 45:34

We don't know. You know, know. That's really hard to believe. I feel like you're a great speaker and orator. That's, that's um, so.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 45:44

So they were like we don't, like we have not heard, we don't know what her voice sounds like, and and they're like you know, she's great at studies and everything else. We just she needs to talk. And and then I I don't know what I took their advice seriously and I started, you know, putting myself out there and like that is back in high school, and like a couple of years later people were literally begging me to stop talking, and so so they do now as well. But, um, now, the devil is unleashed.

Dr. Tirtha Sawant: 46:12

So we're still trying with them and we've not been successful I.

Dr. Michael Kentris: 46:19

I had a very, very similar story when I was in grade school. About third grade I got sent to the speech pathologist for an evaluation because they thought I had a speech impediment of something because I talked so little in class.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 46:34

Yeah, so that's the point. You know like, and now you're a narrator and a podcast host. The point is that I've actually had quite a lot of friends just say to me that you know, it comes easy to you, it comes naturally to you.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 46:49

We cannot do this, and my reply to all of these people is that I was not born with this, trust me, I had to make a conscious effort and even today, like I would love to just, you know, isolate myself and not reply to anybody, like I hate posting on social media daily. I'm the social media director. It is. Everything is a conscious effort that I you, you know keep doing just for the sake of growth and and you have to do it, like all of us are coming from shy and introverted places and and you can reach, like great places must be a neurology thing that is, yeah, most neurology thing, but that is also not like a drawback.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 47:33

I specifically think that introverts have some tendencies that they can use quite constructively their ability to form a great one-on-one connection, being a good listener or paying attention to details, and these sort of things that actually help in forming some strong bonds, even if they're few.

Dr. Ricardo Vivanco: 47:55

It's curious because we all have this in common, right, we all come from shy backgrounds, uh, we are all introverts, uh, we all think twice before posting something on twitter. But I always remember what uh comedian said twitter is not a real place. So we should, we should just do whatever we like and then get some feedback and you know it's, it's fine, you know, don't, don't be afraid of that. So, yeah, and and it's, it was very interesting what dr country said about um, you know, um having like a bigger impact by uh doing, uh, having this podcast and knowing a few people, even if it, if it is only a few and not, you know, every single follower on twitter.

Dr. Ricardo Vivanco: 48:49

Uh, I always remember this that I learned from one of my interviews this this much season is that the difference between you know, focusing on your private practice and doing some academic work whether it is research or, you know, mentoring or teaching it's that the, the, the impact you have on your patients is exponential because you, because you're not only helping the patients you're treating, but also the helpings your mentis are treating. So, yeah, and that's one of the reasons I'm also interested in MedEd as much as you guys. So, yeah, I'm really grateful for being here and learning from you.

Dr. Michael Kentris: 49:31

Awesome. Does everyone want to give a little plug for where people can find you, what you're working on online other than neurotransmitters?

Dr. Ricardo Vivanco: 49:42

Sure, yeah, so I'm on Twitter. I'm, as Dr Vivan Cortex, which is a funny name coming from my, a combination of my last name, which is vivanco, and also cortex, which is, you know, neuro stuff.

Dr. Rida Farhan: 49:59

Uh but yeah yeah, you can find me like that awesome yeah, and you can find me on x at rida farhan r-i-d-a-f-a-r-h-a-n.

Dr. Tirtha Sawant: 50:13

And if any future aspirants are listening, neuro aspirants and want to reach out for guidance, mentorship, anything, I'm more than happy to help excellent, yeah, um, and you can find me on x, as tirthasawant10, also on LinkedIn, and likewise any future aspirants applicants just reach out, even if you just want to talk. I love to listen. Call me a personal therapist, I don't mind. I would love to help in any way that I can. So just glad to be here and I hope everyone that's listening and does have some key takeaways about the mentor-mentee relationship and hope you've been able to help a lot of applicants out there.

Dr. Michael Kentris: 51:00

Awesome. I'm sure some people will find these tips very helpful and hopefully it will help some people down that pathway that you all have kind of figured out on your own, down that pathway that you all have kind of figured out on your own. You can also follow me on x slash Twitter at Dr Kentris D-R-K-E-N-T-R-I-S, and, of course, follow the neurotransmitters, where you can see all of our posts from Rida at neuro underscore podcast. And then you can also find us at the neurotransmitters on LinkedIn and, I believe, instagram as well these days.

Dr. Tirtha Sawant: 51:33

Yes.

Dr. Michael Kentris: 51:34

Excellent, and, of course, check out the website theneurotransmitterscom. Don't forget like, subscribe, share with a friend, spread the word. We're a small community, so let's make some relationships out there, right? Thank?

Dr. Tirtha Sawant: 51:46

you.

Dr. Michael Kentris: 51:49

All right, thanks everybody. Appreciate everyone taking the time and thank you for all your thoughts today.

Dr. Tirtha Sawant: 51:53

Thank you.

Dr. Ricardo Vivanco: 51:55

It's been great, thank you.